Listen to intersex human rights defenders discuss the recent historic UN resolution, and learn more about how you can take action
“We intersex people are human, just like you. And, as humans, we deserve human rights”
In April 2024, something truly transformative happened at the United Nations: the Human Rights Council adopted its first-ever resolution specifically addressing discrimination, violence, and harmful practices against persons with innate variations in sex characteristics.
For this episode, we sat down with four intersex human rights defenders: Crystal Hendricks (ILGA World), Obioma Chukwuike (Intersex Nigeria), Kimberly Zieselman (Outright International) and Kaisli Syrjänen (ISIO – Intersex Human Rights Finland and OII Europe) shared with us what this resolution means to intersex movement, and their own experience as human rights advocates.
This is a much-needed listen to learn more and take action: the United Nations Officer of the High Commissioner for Human Rights has recently published a call for input – seeking to inform the preparation of the report mandated by this resolution, and there is until 20 November 2024 to send your comments!
“Coming down to this resolution, it’s just an important thing and I think it’s something that we’ve been trying, for the last ten years, to say is that… intersex people are not different from anyone else. We are human, just like you. We are not a special kind of humans. We are just humans and we, as humans, we deserve human rights. And intersex rights are human rights.”
Making Rainbow Waves, a podcast by ILGA World
Welcome, welcome everybody to Making Rainbow Waves, a podcast by ILGA World in which we tell the stories of LGBTI human rights defenders worldwide. My name is Daniele Paletta, and today is a very special episode because we usually have only one person that I speak to and this time we have four. And actually, in the same room and not in a virtual meeting so this is really, really, really amazing! Welcome to all of you and I will maybe briefly ask you to introduce yourselves for your audience.
Sure! Hi, I’m Kimberly Zieselman, I’m an intersex human rights defender and an intersex woman. I am currently working as senior advisor for intersex global rights for Outright International and am delighted to be a part of this podcast today hosted by ILGA World.
Right, hello everyone! My name is Obioma Chukwuike. I’m from Nigeria and I work with intersex Nigeria, as an Executive Director. I’m glad to be part of this podcast today and I’m looking forward to the conversation.
Hello everyone. My name is Kaisli Syrjänen. I’m an intersex activist from Finland. I’m the chair of intersex Human Rights Finland (ISIO) and a board member of OII Europe. Good to be here.
Hi everyone. My name is Crystal Hendricks. I’m an intersex woman and intersex human rights defender from South Africa. I’m at the Sex Characteristics Programme of ILGA World and I am happy to be here today.
Thank you! Thank you very much. So as all of you heard, I’m together with four intersex human rights defenders today. We are in Geneva, in a beautiful sunny day, which is almost coming to a close, and the reasons that we are here in Geneva is because the Human Rights Council is working on a resolution explicitly dedicated to combating violence, discrimination and harmful practices against intersex persons. And my understanding is that this is an absolute first. So, I’m going to ask you if you can explain to our audience, what does the resolution mandate and why is it important that this is happening.
Well, I can jump in, um… the resolution will mandate that the UN office of the High Commissioner issue a report and hold a formal report, which has not been done before, and hold an expert panel. The reason that this is important is it’s another step in the UN processes for achieving recognizable human rights for intersex persons globally.
How did we get to that resolution? I know there’s been a pathway, let’s say, in how intersex human rights have been discussed within United Nations spaces. Could you give us a history of how we got to this point?
Um, yeah, sure. So, there’s been a history of intersex activism at the Human Rights Council and within the UN space. Starting from 2015. So, in 2015 the UN member States, mostly pushed by civil society, have increased their attention around the human rights violations that intersex people face. In 2015 we saw the OHCHR that convened the first ever intersex expert meeting, and Kimberly was a part of that meeting, and we were talking about that it’s been ten years later!
We saw in 2016 a group of human rights experts and mechanisms, as well as from the African Commission of Human and People’s Rights and the Council of Europe issued a joint statement urging to end violence and harmful medical practices against intersex people.
And… but like what we can see with the timeline is that nothing has been very different from, you know, what this resolution is asking for and calling for.
In 2019 we also saw the OHCHR published a background note that focused on specific human rights violations that intersex people are facing and I think what it’s been so important and essential when we look at this timeline is that intersex people have really been holding the narrative and we’ve been given an opportunity to ensure that our voices are with whatever report, whatever statement, has come up. And I think we’ve been following this notion about “nothing about us, without us” and maybe someone else wants to add further…
Yeah, I will jump in there to see that, um, thank you Crystal for the background and also this… this also shows the visibility of the work that intersex human rights activists have been doing around the globe. It also shows the similarities of the context of our challenges, our issues, that we face in different contexts between the Global South and the Global North. It also shows that there is a need for an important step to be taken to protect intersex persons from the different forms of discrimination, violations and misinformation that have been flying around about what our body really means. So, it calls for bodily autonomy, self-determination, integrity of our body, which is very important and the core point of what we advocate as intersex persons.
So, I feel that this resolution is long overdue and it should be happening at this point. It also shows that the effort of intersex advocates and activists around the globe is not a waste and whatever we are fighting for is a just cause and it’s time for us to be upheld in a very important state as the UN is doing right now. So, I think it’s something that we have been hoping for, for a very long time. We have had conversations about it, have dreamt about it, and this is the first start of our utopia.
So, I’m happy to see that this is happening and I hope that it doesn’t just stop at the resolution, and that the implementation takes place after the resolution is passed.
It’s really fascinating to see, like, how much time it can actually take to get from one thing to this resolution…
10 years is a very long time, right? and especially when we talk things that impact people’s daily lives. And, um, I think there also needs to be an explanation of why this matters, because usually – if I’m thinking of people outside the activist circles- they think of the UN as something that’s very remote, maybe not useful on an immediate practical level and we know of course that this is not the case. So, how would you explain why this resolution actually matters for everyone, not just for us who are here doing the advocacy work?
I think that’s, like, a really big thing that UN give some guidelines, which really encourages or can encourage States to have national legislation and that would directly impact people’s lives.
And we’ve already seen like a core group of StatesStates pushing for these resolutions. So, do you have a message for them?
I think the message for the intersex core group is a huge thank you… And I think we all sigh a little bit. We all sort of breathe a sigh of relief when we see member States like the core group really step up and articulate our issues and defend our issues, because we’re not used to having other people, particularly people in such powerful positions, defend our human rights. So, for me, it’s very meaningful.
And… I think it’s also important to have allies, but allies that still allow intersex people to hold the narrative. I think we’ve been working with the core group, um, since last year when they released the first statement asking for the adoption of this resolution, and then we also saw civil society groups also releasing a statement for the adoption of this resolution. But what I can say about the four StatesStates in the core group is that they’ve ensured to have continuous communication with the intersex groups. They’ve allowed the intersex groups to, in a way, formulate the resolution for us to provide input and for us to make sure that the language that gets used in the resolution also leads us, you know, to safety as intersex people.
Because we’ve seen resolutions that actually have been more problematic than, you know, that it didn’t really have good influence on States because of language in the resolution. And I think with the core group working with us and, I mean, we are so grateful for the core group is that they’ve really allowed us, you now, to lend our voice because we are intersex people. You know, we face this violence. We face this discrimination. So, I feel like there’s no one better than us to speak on these issues. But I feel like the process has been a process of inclusivity where, even though we do not have the authority to sit at the UN and really speak to States and all the time, but to have these people that are in allies but also allies that are leaning on us. Not allies that are, in a way trying to take away from your voice, but allies that actually include your voice in the conversation. And I feel like that is so important for intersex people.
Yeah, and I mean, to contribute through the previous question about what does it mean for all the persons who are not intersex… I think this is, actually, the most important part of it: because for us as intersex people, we understand our body, we understand our issues; but for people out who are not intersex, they may not understand the need to protect and promote intersex rights. And that is why this resolution is very important, because right now it’s not going to look… It’s going to look at it holistically from the intersections of intersex issues, how it affects us differently, including the SDGs that the UN is very big on. So, I think the resolution also calls for how we have been marginalised for years and also how it will protect intersex that are yet unborn, because intersex is not stopping now is something that will continue to happen, intersex births is still going to happen tomorrow. So, I think it’s important that this resolution highlights the importance to specifically address the issues of marginalidation, discrimination, and harmful practices that intersex persons have faced over the years. And how we can actually collectively ensure that intersex persons are incorporated into different systems that have structurally discriminated us over the years. So, I think it’s important not just for intersex persons, but for everyone at last to understand how they can play a part
And, yeah, I was actually wondering, how do you think the awareness around intersex human rights is at the moment? Because, as you were saying Crystal, there has been lots of international human rights mechanisms, even at a regional level, that have spoken up about intersex issues, and there are more States that have established legal protections -to date nine States worldwide have nationwide restrictions on interventions on intersex minors-, and there are a few who officially protect against discrimination in health settings based on sex characteristics. So, it looks like from an outside perspective that things are moving forward, but I was wondering: what do you think about how is the general public, and even the LGBTI community at large, aware of what intersex means? And if it’s still not enough, what can be done to make this awareness grow?
Yeah, and I think… We were having this conversation and I was telling Kimberly, Obioma and Kaisli that we still have so much work to do because we’ve seen the advancement of intersex rights, and we are seeing that more people are becoming aware of the violations that intersex people face, but there’s still a huge lack of awareness around intersex issues. I mean, we could be publicly on national TV, you know, and you could still walk into a room and people don’t know that you are intersex and they don’t understand anything the intersex community is facing. And I think we’ve been seeing in the last few years people have been trying this whole intersectional approach when it comes to intersex rights saying that, like, the same as how female genital mutilation is a feminist issue, intersex rights are also a feminist issue; the same way as feminists speak about forced sterilisation, do we not see that intersex children are also being forcefully sterilised by having healthy sexually productive organs removed from their body? So, it’s like: intersex issues are a human rights issue. And there’s so many intersections that we can work on these issues but we also don’t see a lot of groups coming together. You know, we don’t see feminist groups coming to the intersex groups and say “How can we help you? how can we raise more awareness and how can we support you?” And even within the LGBT community, there’s also a big lack of knowledge. Like, most of us attend regional and global conferences and sometimes there’s just no conversation around intersex, and you find intersex people speaking to intersex people about our issues and in my thinking, it’s like, so how are we advancing this? Because we are speaking to each other. We should be speaking to the broader community. We need to speak to feminist groups, to women’s rights groups, to children’s rights groups. We need to speak to this thing of… how bodily autonomy is essential for intersex people just how it is for feminists, for children, for women, you know, for everyone that’s being marginalised.
And I also feel like we are also challenged… like, how do we start having these conversations? because I’m also tired of intersex people speaking to intersex people about our issues.
Preach. I mean, everything Crystal said, and more… I do think that is one of the most important next steps for our movement is, because the issue is so intersectional, to actually be more intersectional in our advocacy work and have more allies from the feminist movements, from the children’s rights movements, from the women’s movements. And I think we’re starting to see some progress. Um, I’ve noticed in Europe some of the coalitions against female genital mutilation and cutting FGM are starting to embrace and collaborate with the intersex communities around intersex genital mutilation. I think that’s an excellent sign of progress because there are so many similarities, and this is an issue of bodily autonomy. So, I think, yes, I think in not just talking to each other but talking to other organisations, activists, and people with a platform to raise the issues around intersex genital mutilation and other forms of intersex violence and discrimination is really, really, important.
I have to say I, again, from an outsider perspective, but I’ve also witnessed st the same conferences how like after a while there seems to be like groups that are already grouped by, I mean, identity is not a term that refers to intersex people but like as a broad term, I mean…
Experience, baby, experience. Yes, we group together by experience. I wonder if this is something that some of the international human rights organisations, LGBTQI+ organisations, could do is be more intentional about integrating when there are conferences or there are webinars, um, be more intentional and having like a designed interaction between different groups of people. Because education is needed, I mean, we all need to learn from each other and I know even in the most well-meaning LGBTQ+ spaces there’s still a lot of, there’s a lack of understanding around what iintersex is. And I think a hesitancy to get involved because of not understanding what it is and wanting to do the right thing. So, I feel like educating our allies even within the LGBTQ+ space is really important, still, on intersex.
Coming back to the resolution… yeah, I was positively surprised by the text. There’s a passage, and there has been since the beginning actually, that mentioned misinformation and disinformation among the root causes of the harmful practices against intersex people. And as I was telling you, of course, as a communication person I heard speaking about misinformation and disinformation and my brain went ting! … So, it was really interesting to see, because, I think we are all seeing all across the world, how the anti-gender movement is pushing for bills and policy initiatives that target trans people but impact on intersex people as well. And the impact on the intersex community is very, very, rarely recognised. And actually intersex issues are often instrumentalised by those defending those bills, right?
There was a report by interACT, an organisation in the US, that had this very effective sentence I found, it said: “The core belief of anti-gender opposition is that transgender people must be prevented from changing their bodies while intersex people must be prevented from keeping theirs”. Which is something that I found really enlightening, and so on point unfortunately. So, I was wondering whether you can elaborate on that and on all the impact that this is having on your community.
I mean, I can speak a little bit coming from the United States and what’s been happening in the US over the last couple of years with a wave of state-level anti-trans bills and specifically laws that are being passed banning gender-affirming care for transgender youth, that are specifically carving out exceptions, or I should say including exceptions, for intersex babies and children. So, in other words, a law will be banning doctors from providing gender-affirming care that a trans youth wants and needs, but specifically in the same bill stating it’s okay to do genital mutilation or irreversible surgeries on intersex infants and children. So, it’s actually the anti-trans movement, if you will, and the legislation and the push against gender-affirming care for trans youth has in some ways lifted the intersex issue to the surface in the United States, because of these bills specifically noting intersex, but not in a good protective way: in a way that, just as you stated, is very much like “We don’t want you to have this body that is not typical” or, you know, in their eyes “not normal.”
And I think that’s what it is. It’s all about kind of controlling bodies and controlling the narrative, about what is normal, what’s healthy, and what’s acceptable. And this is what’s happening in the United States and around the world to the transgender community, to the intersex community, and let’s be honest, to women everywhere. The common theme here is control over bodies and a lack of bodily autonomy. So, this is much larger than just an intersex issue. This is an anti-gender, anti-rights, I think anti-women movement globally, that really requires all of us to work together to push back against.
Yeah. And I also think with the movement, I think we’ve been seeing it a lot with the anti-gender movement, when it comes to intersex people is that they really want to pathologize our bodies, right? Like, even we see languages such as “disorder of sexual development” and it’s in a way proving like they’re using us as tokens to say: “if we can fix these people and assign them a sex or a gender, this is something that could be done to anyone, right?”
So, it’s putting the notion out there that we can normalise intersex people’s bodies. And if we can do that, then, how can we not, like, normalise the entire world?
And that is the actual notion that was going on. And that’s the big debate. And as intersex activists, we should be part of the conversation around the anti-gender and anti-rights movement because intersex people always had their bodily autonomy stripped away, intersex people always didn’t have a voice around their self-determination, about who they are as an intersex person, and these surgeries have been happening for years and years and years. And a lot of intersex people have, you know, dealt with a lot of physical problems related to this but also like around their gender and around expressing themselves and who they are.
And it’s so essential that, even though the trans experience, like, being trans and being intersex is completely different from who you are – being intersex has nothing to do with your sexuality, has nothing to do with your gender identity, when being trans is directly about someone’s gender identity, about who they believe that they are and who they are… But somehow there’s this intersecting where people confuse the themes of, you know, of trans and intersex people.
But now what we are seeing in the US with the bills that are saying “no surgeries for trans youth” but the same bills will say “but if you are born with a variation of whatever sex characteristics, then we could still perform surgery on you”. So, it’s almost like they’re putting us up against each other as well, and I feel like in the movement we also, you know, have to be able, like I always say, trans rights are also a feminist issue.
The same as intersex rights. And at some point, we meet each other, especially when it comes to legal gender recognition, because intersex people face the same problems as trans people. Also, when it comes to gender-affirming healthcare, like, I’ve spoken to Kimberly and I’m like: “there’s no adult care for intersex people.” Like, they will have surgeries performed when you are a child and they just let you go and now you are this person growing up in this intersex body but there’s no healthcare, like, you don’t know really what to do and there’s no options for you.
We see similarities happening in the trans movement. So, when I look at the anti-rights and anti-gender movement… it’s like Kimberly says, like, it’s not only just targeting trans people, it’s targeting intersex people, but it’s also targeting women, you know, trying to strip away their bodily autonomy. So, I also feel there’s a bigger conversation we need to have, to come together, and talk about the anti-rights and the anti-gender movement.
Yeah. I agree, I agree. I think, speaking of the anti-rights or anti-human rights movements, on how they try to control… because if you look at it from the broader view, it’s about controlling what you should look like because of the binaries. The binary notion of black and white. And it also makes me wonder how we actually think that in a world that is as diverse as people, not just people even plants and animals, how then do you decide for people how their body should look like?
Because if you look at the irreversible surgeries, the medicalisation of intersex bodies, nobody speaks about the effects, the impacts. They only speak about how to fix the body. Nobody wants to ask you how do you feel. I’ve met a lot of intersex children who have undergone these surgeries. And I see them and I know what they’re going through, what their lives will look like. Even though I cannot tell them, because I don’t want to make them lose hope. When the parents ask me “Is this ever going to be all right?”, I don’t have an answer for them. And I think that is the bigger conversation about the consequences of what we don’t want that they are forcing on us.
Meanwhile, they are group of persons that want this for themselves, that have chosen that they want this for themselves, they are not given them the right to do what they want to do. So, for me I think it’s about robbing it from people: what’s the sense of this? it’s destabilizing the two communities. It’s making the two communities lose their purpose and ownership of their body. And if we’re talking about human rights not being indivisible, why are we dictating for a group of persons that have said that these particular procedures are harmful to our body? These particular procedures leave us with lifetime effects that affect not just our medical situation or status but the whole life. Because if you look at the chain reaction of what the surgeries, the medicalisation, the harmful practices do to you, it doesn’t only affect you medically, it affects you socially.
It excludes you from having families, it excludes you from having relationships, it excludes you from having even employment or even education. Because I’ve met intersex children who are no longer in school because of the complications from these surgeries.
So, I think the conversation should be about how do we look beyond what we want aand look at what the people that actually face these experiences need. The ownership of these issues is what we should be looking at. And I think that is why this resolution is very important because, like I said earlier, is not just about the community now, but it’s about the wider society understanding the impacts and consequences of some of these harmful practices and violations on our bodies.
I would like to add here the perspective of children’s rights. In my national organisation, our main cooperation is with three children’s rights organisations, and that really leads the discussion to some other levels than just about… it’s about children’s rights issues simply.
Yeah… I also just think, like, coming down to this resolution, it’s just the important thing and I think it’s something that we’ve been trying to, for the last ten years, to say that…intersex people are not different from anyone else. We are human, just like you. We are not a special kind of humans. We are just humans and we, as humans, we deserve human rights. And intersex rights are human rights. So, I feel like we are at this big stepping stone and regardless of all the… everything that we face around anti-gender movement, around our bodies being pathologised, our bodies being medicalised, all the, you know, discrimination, the stigma that we go through as intersex people, I think the important thing is that we need this resolution at the UN to be used as an advocacy tool, in one sense. But also, just use it as a tool to say that intersex people are here, we exist and we also deserve human rights, and I think that is so essential and important.
And we’re not asking for special rights.
Yeah, exactly!
That’s the other thing, you know… We’re not asking for anything unique or special. We’re just asking for human rights like everybody else.
Yeah, I always tell people, like, sometimes I wish I could just exist. Yeah, like, you know, just like other people I see them walking and just existing, like, I just want to be like… you know, I don’t want to be questioned, I don’t want to be…
Also, a burden… as a human rights defender, as an intersex human rights defender. To all these people who are in the room talking about this, to be, you know, fighting against it, telling our own stories over and over again. Um, there’s a real huge emotional price that we all pay, and that’s another reason for needing allies too. I’m a big believer in and the importance of allies in our movement… intersex- informed, ideally intersex-led, but supported by allies, it is so, so, important for many reasons.
So, that’s my call to action, to all you listeners out there in podcast land: please become allies. We need your support, including the trans movement. The trans movement also. I’m going to say this, and it’s maybe a bit controversial, but I think they need to step up. You know, I see at least in the United States, I used to run interACT, you mentioned interACT earlier, and they’re reaching out and being very inclusive of their intersex siblings in the United States, and collaborating. And I think that’s a really great thing. I also want to see more well-funded and powerful trans organisations do this impact to the intersex communities because I think we’re better together.
And I think I can’t leave this out of the conversation… but if we speak about stepping up, then my call to action is also to donors, like, to donors and to funders. intersex people are the most underfunded group because we don’t have funding. You know, we only have so little resources to have four people at the UN, at this important and vital time. We were supposed to have funding to have more, you know, like at least 20 to 25 activists taking up space, talking to States, changing the narrative, letting them see that intersex people exist. But because funding is so limited for intersex organising, I really want donors to step up and not just, you know, speak on it, but actually implement and make sure there’s funding available for intersex groups and also understanding that intersex groups are also very small. Our organisations are not often set up like standard LGBTQI organisations. But also, to meet us where we are at, because I feel sometimes the process of applying for funding can be so difficult and daunting for intersex organising that intersex people give up, you know, at the end of the day.
So, my call to action is to donors to also fund intersex groups, but also meet intersex groups where they are at and make sure that your funding can be flexible, your application process is flexible, and you know, just meeting intersex people where they are at.
Yeah… Nothing about us without us. We can’t be left out. And I think it’s just like the resolution, it’s high time that everyone, including the funders, step up in the game to include intersex-led focused projects and programs because it’s not that we don’t appreciate the fact that sometimes they lump us into other larger LGBTQI programs or project, but we want something that we can use to address some of these issues that we have talked about in this podcast. You know, unique issues. We also need allies and support other groups, but sometimes we need to speak about some of the issues that we face. And it’s very vital that… is one thing that we have been seeing for years now. I see changes but I think we can do better, that’s my take, I think the donors can do better and I know they can do better. And I also think that it’s important that we realise that we cannot be on the same capacity, just like you mentioned Crystal, organising or other spectrums that have been organising for years, you know. We are trying to build a movement and we have been trying so hard with the little resources that we can grab. Imagine if we are given access to more resources what we can do.
So, I think is about opening up more space for us and allowing us to grow too. Because sometimes I hear from and say: “You don’t have the capacity to do this”, but I cannot have the capacity if I’m not doing that… I can just sit and have the capacity; I have to access some funds for having the capacity… so, who is going to give me those funds?
Capacity building is very important for us, and that is what we need right now.
And that’s also a question of the misinformation and disinformation, lack of awareness and understanding. If there is not enough funding, there is not enough information out there.
It’s really the moment for me, as a person who is not part of the intersex community, to commend what you’ve done. Because, again, as you said, you are very small groups and you’ve really been moving mountains. And the fact that in 10 years it’s gone from grassroots activism that continues alongside this. And that’s too the biggest part of what I guess you do, like, to the United Nations and on having a resolution approved. I mean, this is really moving mountains.
And, I’m very sure about that, but maybe, tell me if I’m wrong, but this also comes at a very high emotional cost for you. Because, I mean, you’re here in the room with me after a very long day of speaking with people who have not always been friendly and kind, right? And you’re still here talking to me and talking about your work and your personal experiences. And this is about your personal life, right? Like, it’s a lot. So, I’m not sure people tell you this enough, but please, let me: you all deserve a shout for what you’re doing!
[laughs]
Thank you! And I think… when we were just finishing in the room, I said something and I told someone from one of the States that it’s difficult being in this room, but it’s also important to be in this room. Because I’ve always lived with the notion that if I could change one intersex person’s life and if they don’t have to go through all the trauma that I’ve gone through, I feel like I’ve done my work on this earth. And I think it’s so important that many others are afforded opportunities where they can fight for their rights. So, while we have this privilege and we have this opportunity, it’s important for us to do it. But it’s also important for us to go back and take care of ourselves and make sure that self-care is a priority, take a moment, step away, and come back to fight another day.
I think we’re coming to the close of our conversation today. And I just wanted to thank you so much again for being here. I wanted to close with the last question, which is: What happens next with the resolution being passed? Like, now what? And how does intersex civil society, grassroots groups and allies maybe even, how they can all get involved at this point?
I mean, there are many ways they can get involved. Because the resolution is passed, the next step is implementation, because the resolution is a text, a binding text, it’s call to action, more or less, so it’s about how do member States start acting on the resolution – including the ones that voted and did not vote for it. That is the bigger picture. Because we’re not hoping that it’s only the people that voted for it that will implement it in their country, but also people that did not vote for it just understand that there’s a need because this is a human rights call. And it also calls for more grassroots mobilisation, development of legislations, laws, policies, that can protect and also bring out the issues at the grassroots level. So, I think is about how we can pick the pieces from what the resolution have said to use it as a national advocacy tool and also a global advocacy tool.
And I also think this is where the work actually begins, because now we have given a mandate to go into the world and, you know, continue to advocate. And it’s also more work for us as activists to actually organise more, and also find ourselves in spaces where we have not been before conversing for allyship with other groups to also speak about these issues, and also bring out solutions, sustainable solutions, that can actually better the lives of intersex persons around the globe.
So, I think it is more about taking it to the next level, after the resolution is passed.
But I also think that it affords us really an opportunity within society. I think, specially someone coming from Africa being intersex has always been seen as a curse or a bad omen or there’s something negative on the family, and that’s why your child has been born intersex… and also, I’ll give a trigger warning but, in many instances, being intersex has also led to the infanticide and the killing of intersex children. And I think when we saw the resolution 552 at the African Commission of Human and People’s Rights, it was an acknowledgement that intersex people exist and we are part of the community, and we are part of the society, and that was just so important, like, we are not a bad omen, we are not a curse. We are human like, you know, just like everyone else. And I think this resolution is another tool for us to use within our advocacy, and even though it might not be binding, but we can hold our States accountable to say that this is what the UN calls for, because we know that intersex people are not included in many things.
If we look at the sustainable development, even LGBTQI is not mentioned there, but we look on SDG3 – on good health and well-being- when our countries do statistics, they don’t include intersex people when they speak about sexual health rights and sexual reproductive health rights, like, we are not mentioned, right? And being intersex… IGM: these surgeries that happen, it’s linked directly to sexual reproductive health rights, but we are not mentioned.
And I feel like this now gives us an opportunity to take from the human rights perspective, but also then merging it with sustainable development, and then as intersex people we could then go to our States, you know, and hold them accountable and have conversations: “So, this resolution has been implemented, what are you going to do about it?” Right? Speak to our States and have conversations. And also, I mean, we are excited for the mandate on the report to be developed by the OHCHR.
Because, also, for intersex activism, it’s been 10 years at the UN, but for others they’ve been doing this for longer than 10 years. But also, we have so little tools, because we’ve been so underfunded, and I feel like every tool that we could get is essential for us to, you know, successfully advocate in actually obtaining this world where intersex people are protected.
So, for me, I’m like, how intersex groups, grassroots groups, any high-level groups, they will be able to use the report from the OHCHR, take what’s happening to their own national activities and hold the States accountable. So, I feel like we are building the toolbox for intersex advocacy, and now it’s not just coming from intersex organising but it’s coming from the UN. And, you know, so I feel like it has no power even though it’s not binding but it will be a powerful tool that we could use to make our States aware and to make the world awake that we exist, we are 1.7% of the population, there’s millions of intersex people. You cannot deny that. And now the UN has recognised us, so, what more do you need? Now we need to be protected.
It’s really wonderful to feel the energy in all what you say and the power and the commitment that you all put into your work. So, I just, yeah, I just wanted to thank you once again for having been here. It’s getting dark outside and in this room as well. So, I really wanted to thank you very, very much for all the work that you’re doing. And for having me here with you today…
Thank you!
Making Rainbow Waves is a podcast by ILGA World. This episode was hosted by Daniele Paletta and edited by Daría Poncio. You can find every episode on all streaming platforms. A transcription of this episode in English, and its translation to Spanish, are available on ilga.org. Thanks for listening.
