Our struggle goes well beyond the Brazilian resolution. With or without the UN, we will give voice again and again until our existence and rights are recognized.

An interview with Rosanna Flamer-Caldera and Kursad Kahramanoglu, Co-Secretaries General of the International Lesbian and Gay Association.

After the text was first introduced in 2003, it is now the second time the United Nations Commission on Human Rights (UNCHR) postpones the debate over the Brazilian resolution… What happened in Geneva this year?

Rosanna Flamer-Caldera: The truth is, Brazil took everybody by surprise when it presented its resolution on sexual orientation in 2003. Most countries were very critical of its chances of being approved, because the Brazilian government did not have the time to build consensus before putting the text to a vote. It is such a sensitive issue anyway; just think of how sexual and women's rights are still on the table after so many years of struggle! In 2003, members of the Organisation of Islamic Conferences asked for 55 corrections to the text, making it obviously unvotable. This year, the whole process went more smootly and discreetly, even though it was clear this was one of the hottest topics of the year. Brazil did not withdraw the text; it simply asked that the debate be postponed till next year. And nobody objected to the postponement. The decision was so quick it went almost unobserved in the plenary room!

Kursad Kahramanoglu: Some say Brazil was left alone, not supported enough by other countries, even though the European Union announced its support way ahead of time. The German government was very supportive, for example. But this resolution simply cannot be a "Western only initiative". Others claim Brazilian President Lula's government backed down so as not to hurt the Arab countries he plans to invite to an economic forum this fall. There is no official story, nor simple explanation, of course. The United Nations is a unique forum, with its own dynamics; nations who would hardly stand up for their own people' s human rights at home will fight for a word in Geneva. It seems though that more than fighting for principles, countries make a point of opposing other countries, getting revenge for other issues or defending interests that have little to do with human rights.

Rosanna: The Brazilian resolution happens in very troubled times and could be easily used politically to oppose secular countries to fundamentalist ones. The United States did not make any move in favour of the resolution; when they were asked what position they would take if the text was to be put to a vote, they simply said they would then get their orders directly from the White House.


The LGBT activists seemed to be relieved this year when the postponement was announced. Why is that?

Rosanna: It was indeed a victory because if the resolution had been put to a vote, there was no guarantee it would have passed. We were also conscious that if it were rejected, it would probably have been left off the UN agenda for a number of years.

Kursad: This is a learning process for all of us: for the first time in its history, the UNCHR hosted a very large team of LGBT activists and NGOs coming from all parts of the world. Apart from getting acquainted with the United Nations, we also had to learn to work together! A serie of panels was held within the UN, and activists made public statements there mentioning sexual orientation and gender identity.

Rosanna: This year also gave us the opportunity to broaden our views while we were in touch with other NGOs, including the ones working within other social movements. We realized our struggle is part of a much wider agenda of human rights.


What happened to ILGA’s petition supporting the Brazilian resolution?

Kursad: It is still open. ILGA was officially received by the Chairman of the Commission, the Australian Ambassador Mike Smith. We meant to deliver the petition, but we also wanted to get a sense of what was going on behind the scenes. It appeared this was not the right time to hand in the petition and we decided to keep it open for another year. The petition was indeed a test: we had no idea what number of signatures we could gather in such a limited period. 45 000 individual signatures, about a 1000 organisations signing in only three months. It's been a good surprise, but it is obviously not good enough. We did not choose the timing, but Brazil is giving us an opportunity to get together as a global community. Somehow, this is about us testing our forces as a movement and testing our ability to mobilize our people, but also the main audience in general. We still need to get the word out to the general public. Unfortunately the press, even the LGBT media, did not give much coverage to the subject.


What was achieved at this last session of the United Nations Commission on Human Rights?

Rosanna: To start with, the debate is still there to be held, and the resolution forces many countries to face the issue of sexual diversity. About 70 countries still criminalize same sex relationships, most of the time as an heritage of colonial law. The resolution acts as an invitation to revisit and correct these laws. But “sexual orientation” is also a very new term for the international forum. To this effect, the resolution on extrajudicial, summary or arbitrary executions, which was adopted this year, is also good news. It asks governments to investigate arbitrary executions committed on discriminatory grounds, including sexual orientation.

Kursad: I am very proud and thankful to the activists who joined us in Geneva this year. They did an excellent job with very few resources. Thanks to them, we developed closer relationships with many delegations, but one of our most significant achievements was an invitation to a GRULAC meeting (the group of Latin American and Caribbean countries at the UN). It gave us the opportunity to officially ask them to collectively co-sponsor the resolution next year. It is a very significant step in the Latin American context after the Argentinean group CHA and ILGA were received by the government in Buenos Aires last year in order to get their support for the Brazilian resolution.


What are your plans for this coming year?

Rosanna: We need to ensure next year's resolution includes gender identity, to "educate" the international forum with a concept they know nothing about, and to raise their awareness of the injustices suffered by transsexuals and intersex people. Next year's delegation should include more transsexuals, more French speaking people, especially from Africa. Visibility really makes a difference; governments can ignore us only to the extent they do not see us.

Kursad: This additional year gives us time to grow stronger. We need to concentrate our efforts on the 53 countries that will sit next year. We should ask our supporters, especially European countries, to be more assertive; and we should ask Brazil to have the courage to follow what they have started. The gloves are off; it is no longer possible to get UN adopt anything without a real campaign on lgbt rights. Especially on the issue of gender identity, all the countries of the world which support this human right should declare themselves and not hide behind each other or give in to domestic or international pressures. This resolution is only one step towards our main goal: to get rid of discrimination against LGBT people anywhere in the world. Once approved, it would also mean the UN would be able to consider and specifically investigate human rights violations on the grounds of sexual orientation and gender identity. Work at the UN is important; but the real changes will be made at home in each country, with the help of all activists interacting locally with their governments. We must not to forget our struggle goes well beyond the Brazilian resolution. With or without the UN, we will give voice again and again until our existence and rights are recognized.